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Saturday, November 22, 2008

Removing Idols from kaaba - Wikipedia Blunder

MUSLIMS BEWARE
Kaaba and the Wikipedia Blunder
Mike Ghouse, Dallas, Texas


I cannot believe Wikipedia is taken as a gospel by so many, every word in it is taken as the ultimate truth. You will discover it's danger in the following report. A statement is made "While destroying each idol, Muhammad recited [Qur'an 17:81] which says "Truth has arrived and falsehood has perished for falsehood is by its nature bound to perish."[28][29] . A few of my Hindu friends have assumed that Terrorism has it's origin in the above act, of course the very same statement is a fodder to the Neocons, who rejoice and pass it one to every one with a comment, "I told you so, Islam is an intolerant religion".

Continued: http://www.foundationforpluralism.com/WorldMuslimCongress/Articles/Kaaba-and-the-wikipedia-blunder.asp

27 comments:

  1. Mike:

    I really appreciate your dedication for pluralism or co-existence. Thank you so much for taking time to explain this reference further.
    If this wiki reference is not correct, it should be corrected with authentic corroboration ASAP because this is being used by many as reference in power point slides.

    When some one reads this and try to connect with the modern day terrorism - it appears that the source was violent and people are just following their spiritual leaders. Aurangjeb was one of the most fundamentalist king and we all have studied in history books.

    My initial view on Islam was this . [The Real Islam vs Hinduism: As understood by a moderate Hindu ]

    But, over period of time, when I attended seminars, read few articles and interacted with few individuals - all pointed about the 'Kaaba' source.

    I have been struggling between your view and internet historical references from trusted sources [ wiki, Universities]. I wish you are right.

    Thank you so much for your time and interest to educate people.

    regards
    Manoj

    ReplyDelete
  2. Assalamu alaikum wa rahamtullahi wa barakatuh.

    I read your piece. My understanding was that part of his mission was to re dedicate the Kaaba for monotheism.

    I am a firm believer in pluralism, but we are staunch monotheists. We can't apologize for that.

    The Kaaba is for the One God.

    Please clarify what you mean.

    In His Love,

    Hesham

    ReplyDelete
  3. Hesham,

    The Wiki quotes that prophet recited "While destroying each idol, Muhammad recited [Qur'an 17:81] which says "Truth has arrived and falsehood has perished for falsehood is by its nature bound to perish."[28][29]

    This is not true, the Sura has nothing to do with this event. And the one's who are not familiar with have a misunderstandings. WE have to correct this in Wikipedia.

    Can you do to this? I am swamped
    Mike Ghouse

    ReplyDelete
  4. I heard this same thing, in fact. It may not have been revealed then, but that does not mean he can't use that verse at that time.


    Hesham

    ReplyDelete
  5. The Sura is about Meraj and has nothing to do with with Idols or Kaaba.

    Mike

    ReplyDelete
  6. Agree Asma,

    But there is a whole lot of them who are sticking in our face that "see, Islam is intolerant" your prophet destroys the idols and reads the verses from Quraan.

    The verses have nothing to do with the event. Wiki needs to correct this.

    Mike

    ReplyDelete
  7. Hi Mike,
    The article is too convoluted. Is the yellow highlighted para the only error or is it the major one.

    We all need to live in the present and not the past...particularly the distant past in which none of us participated and so do not know what happened. In any event what happened in the past is relevant to the present only if we remain attached to our own notions about the past of which we have no real way of knowing the truth.

    Much Love
    Bahram

    ReplyDelete
  8. Bahram,

    That statement in wiki is maknig a believers out of a few, who say "look your prophet destroyed the idols and read verses from Quraan, hence Islam is intolerant"

    Those verses have nothing to do with the event. Hence correction is needed. It is not the flaw, it is the deliberate maligning that is the issue.

    Mike

    ReplyDelete
  9. You are just now catching on that Wickipedia is pure Zionist propaganda? Well, better late than never.

    John Gibson

    ReplyDelete
  10. John,

    There are a few individuals who are driving hate agenda, to make idiots out of the public and make money. No religious person would spew hate, but those who wear a religious garb and out to make money, selling fear and hate.

    We, the silent moderat majority need to speak up. Like Jefferson says, we have to restore the public life to the public.

    ReplyDelete
  11. Dear Mike,AA,

    Your reply is apologetic for no reason at all....or maybe there is a reason that you will care to record.

    The Ka'aba was constructed, by ProphetAbraham and his son,Prophet Ishmael as THE House for the worship of the one and only true God known to and believed in by Abraham and Ishmael.

    The 360 idols in and around the Ka'aba were a later accretion in violation of the sanctity of
    the Ka'aba to which Muhammad,peace be upon him(*) was not committed in any way....as very aptly
    recounted by Manoj.... the very reason of conflict between the pagan Meccans and Muhammad*.

    It was thus only natural that upon the first opportunity, Muhammad would remove the Ka'aba of those idols.

    But that was that.

    Muhammad,* did not ask his followers to violate any existing place of worship (and its idols) of
    any non muslim community.The most convincing proof of this is the hundreds of thousands of temples (adorned with idols of all the various gods that our Hindu brothers believe in) that survived the muslim rule of about a thousand years in India.

    And what is more: many muslim rulers gave lands and properties for the upkeep of temples,some even had new temples constructed to
    replace earlier existing temples which had had to be demolished upon having been desecrated through the criminal act of someone or the other, committed within the sacred precincts of those temples.

    Regards,
    Farid

    ReplyDelete
  12. Farid, the simple piont of the article is - that a verse is miquoted to create ill-will. I have clarified that and it needs to be fixed on Wiki.

    ReplyDelete
  13. Can't you correct it, on Wikipedia? I think you can. I think you can contact them and submit corrections; in fact, I seem to recall that they ask for contribution. Wikipedia is a work-in-progress. Go to it, Mike; you're the guy to do so!!

    ReplyDelete
  14. Just FYI, if you see a mistake on Wikipedia, you can correct it yourself. Anyone can edit anything on Wikipedia, that’s the beauty of it.

    ReplyDelete
  15. Janab Ghosemike and Manoj.

    hi,

    thank you for bringing this important subject of wikipedia.html infront of all of us. It is now our duty to work hard to bring the truth. there are lot more subject which has been wrongly posted on wikipedia. my actual understanding is that, wikipeida is a website whenever, whoever, and whatever any individual want to post, they can sign-in and able to post according to his/her own way of thinking.

    If this is the case, I think our first duty is to inquire about the actual way of sensor control. Do Wikipedia moderator handle minutely each and every subject before posting?.


    shahnawaz mohammed
    Toronto- Canada.

    ReplyDelete
  16. please see amovie called "khuda Ke Liye"...more head scratching results....

    ReplyDelete
  17. I really do not know how you landed by my e mail. Anyhow this certainly is a subject that I hold some interest in. I have gone through the contents at the site you have indicated. From what I understand it appears that your good intentions are overriding visible evidence. I am not saying that your observation about how the the majority of muslims and non-muslims would view the issue of jihad is wrong either. (Of course I am confused with the figures you have provided!) But the undeniable fact is that today what we see around us is the fight between two monotheistic religions at the international level and for us in India, it has translated to demonising Hinduism and Hindus in a vicious way. As I see it, it is only Hinduism that preaches pluralism and Hindus who practice it. But still Narendra Modi is being made a demon by alleging to have failed to control post-Godra riots in a jiffy. But those who positively encouraged and even lead the anti-sikh riots of 1984 which was most vicious in the national capital itself and which was justified by the then Prime Minister Rajeev by his notorious quote ' when a giant tree falls the earth beneath it will shake' are put on a pedstal and even offered ministerial berths in the union cabinet!

    I also strongly disagree with your observation 'Look at us Indians, we jump up and down even when we see something about religion, Gujarat and Babri on the net, and we live in 21st century yet we let ourselves drench in hate.' I do not know if it is purely loose statement or a mischievous one but do watch out when you make them because they project you as an imposter rather than a messiah of peace.

    All I can say for the moment is that I pray for the success of your endeavour to bring harmony amoung the people of the world.

    The contents of this mail may please be communicated to Mr Manoj Padhi too, if possible.

    Regards and best wishes
    Ravi

    ReplyDelete
  18. Ravi,

    When the reference was made to Gujarat, Babri and religion, it was made to all Indians. I have never written or said Hindus or Muslims, to me, we are Indians, and we are from every hue, but act the same. Yes, some of us Indians jump at it instead of discussing in civil terms. That's us and we have to do better than that.

    Pluralisitic attitudes are prevalent in all people and in all socieities. It is part of the living, living and let live.

    ReplyDelete
  19. I think you are doing well, but I was surprized what makes you to select me in order to send me e-mail, but I think a religious competition which is ful of radicalization that the religion of islam is prohibited to obey the who beleive this is discussing.

    Eventually, I dont have any idea for this issues, I will appreciate if you send me further information in order to adept well this issues.


    Best regards


    Ahmed Dualeh

    ReplyDelete
  20. Sabahat Ashraf has undertaken to fix the wikipedia issue, here is a discussion thread at the bottom - and immediately below is what will be done, with a few changes. Original Posting at :: http://www.foundationforpluralism.com/WorldMuslimCongress/Articles/Kaaba-and-the-wikipedia-blunder.asp and there are comments at the end of the article as well.

    Jazak Allah Khair
    Mike Ghouse

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    THE LINK AT WIKI: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaaba then go to the part "at the times of Mohammad" to see the entry.

    THE STATEMENT: "While destroying each idol, Muhammad recited [Qur'an 17:81] which says "Truth has arrived and falsehood has perished for falsehood is by its nature bound to... Read More perish."[28][29] .

    STATEMENT TO BE REVISED AS " Muhammad (pbuh) removed the idols from the Kaaba to reclaim the sanctuary built by Abraham for the mono-theistic tradition, and he further declared a general amnesty to all the Meccans so peace can be restored in and around the sanctuary of kaaba

    ReplyDelete
  21. You are right- Pluralisitic attitudes are prevalent in all people and in all socieities. But let us be clear-not in all religions except in Hinduism. In fact Hindus are taunted for the million deities they worship. For them Christ, Prophet, Saibaba and Amma can be added to the pantheon without any inhibitions. But I understand that in countries like Saudi Arabia they do not permit even the migrant Hindus to bring in an image of their Gods for personl worship to that country!

    ReplyDelete
  22. Ravindran,

    Pluralism is very dear to me and I practice it in every aspect of life.

    As a group we have condemned the Saudi Practices of preventing a Hindu to worship Ganesha in his own room, Moscowites preventing to build a Hare Krishna Temple, temple destruction in Trinidad by a right wing fanatic.. YOu will find that in our blogs of World Muslim Congress, Foundation for Pluralism and other blogs.

    Pluralism is prevalent in all societies including Saudi Arabia and Moscow - it is the individuals and a few in authority that are the problem. What is happenind in our own backyards - Orissa, Karnataka, Gujarat are not pluralims... not all subscribe to the wrong doing, only a few , but they will do a lot of damage.

    It is necessary for you and I to condemn the wrongs done by one and all, our and others.

    Peace

    ReplyDelete
  23. Ghouse

    You again quote only Orissa, Karnataka, Gujarat and state that what has happened there is NOT pluralism. The unfortunate thing is that somebody comes to your home and abuses your beliefs, with a similing face and in soft tones, of course, till you blow over. Onlookers see only the tantrum thrown by you and immediately the vistor starts crying foul and the other pick up the chorus. It is a grand game. Are you aware that christian missionaries have distributed booklets depicting hindu gods in blasphemous terms and that is what led to the problems in Mangalore. I have also read reports that missionaries have distributed such booklets in front of the famous Kapaleeshwar temple in Chennai. What audacity!

    ReplyDelete
  24. No one on the earth can recite all the problems in one breath... when a few names are use, it means all such names.

    ReplyDelete
  25. Mr. ravindran, India is a highly secular country all the religious practice can be done without discrimination, while Soudi Arabia is a highly Islamic country which not allows idol worship. Both these are the codes of the nations. If a foreigner visits India he has to agree the rules and regulations of India, same like that in Soudi arabia also. The punishment for a crime in Soudiarabia is same to muslims and others..

    ReplyDelete
  26. Mr Aadam

    Nobody has stopped anybody from practising any religion in India but when some religionists want to propagate their religion by going to other religionists and telling them that their religion is useless and fraud and they should convert that will call for retalitation. That is defence not aggression.

    Coming to nations and laws, both are supposed to be for the good of human beings and in that sense need to have humaneness as the underlying factor and not domination or suppression. It applies to India and Saudi Arabia.

    ReplyDelete
  27. religios freedom is the fundamental right of mankind---one can invite any other person to embrace a religion but cannot force him to become a mulim ,a christian or a hindu or a buddhist--the holy KAABa was erected by the prophets-adam-abraham and ismaeel on the command of the ALMIGHTY--the very first house of MONOTHEIST GOD/ALLAH--and is hithherto supposed to be reserved for the worship of ONE GOD/ALLAH

    ReplyDelete